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  #21  
Old 12-01-2006, 10:57 PM
ユリネ ユリネ is offline
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my 5 cents:
a melee fonewearl is very much doable, just very difficult to pull off, and requires a lot of patience and planning. however, keep in mind, you're support first (ie. sd/jz, resta at all times), meleer second. plus, sd, jz, and resta just prevents your ass getting handed to you on a consistent basis anyway.

the mag is probably the most important part of the meleeing fonewearl, yet is the most neglected. ATA means everything since the unboosted base FOnewearl ATA is very bad compared to other FOs. However, the FOnewearl ATA maxes at 183, ungodly compared to the FOmarl which maxes at around 170. not only does it make a difference in attacks, but also in the specials that you land on enemies. the absolute least amount of dex should be 106, which will max the FOnewearl ATA at level 198.

At lvl 11x, you want to priortize on ATA since you'll need to hit things. And if you want to regen tp, it's even more important. Boosting dex will obviously max your char dex at lower levels, and it's well worth it until you are comfortable enough to equip a mag with lower dex. a mag with 130 dex may do her good. possibly add 55-60 power, but it's not necessary. her unboosted base power will max out at lvl 15x.

mat usage: you should mainly focus on mind mats (for obvious reasons), and possibly evp mats (this i cannot confirm). one of the interesting things is that the fonewearl does have very high evp honestly, though, i'm not well versed in mat usage, so, don't mind me on this subject. don't worry about dfp mats since god/bodies would probably be the best source for dfp

equipment: the fonewearl does not deal straight out damage like a lot of the other classes can do, but she can use her ATA to a much better cause: special attacks.

The double saber should be the primary weapon for for damage--and for tp regenerative purposes. at a high enough level, you'll be able to max out the tp regeneration at 100 tp per successful hit in ult. this equates to very, very fast tp regeneration and results in rare fluid consumption and means unlimited rabarta, rafoie, megid spam. Target TP to reach this is 2500 tp. because of the independence from going to p2 to restock on fluids that plagues all other nuking/pure spellcasting newmen, FOnewms in particular, this equates to building pbs and taking part in 4-way pb blasts, giving everyone lvl 81 SD. Even though the fonewearl has crappy dfp, lvl 81 SD makes her block everything (except for goran detonators and sand rappies) in episode 4. coupled with a regen gear adv/bp, it means even more TP regeneration and even hp regeneration. this is not to be taken lightly.

a vivienne can be substituted in to deal significantly more damage, but the main drawback is the much lower tp regen you get from it. Depending on the difficulty and the enemies, it may or may not be worth it.

The holy ray is one of the two most important rifles she can have in her arsenal, imo. with hit, she can paralyze basically everything in her path in ep1, in ep 4, it may take some time, but it's essential when fighting girts and you have no RAs around, and dorphons if all in the party are lower level or are FOs. this weapon is also not to be taken lightly.

the bringer's rifle can deals the brunt of the damage. against the much tougher monsters, dorphans and girts. straight meleeing a dorphan or girt is just asking for major punishment and frustration. quartering the hp of baddies multiples of times with these weapons helps save that and makes meleeing quite efficient. especially useful in PW4 and towers.

The madam's umbrella is for crowd control where the double saber fails. even with 0%'s it's still a formidable weapon, able to control a sizable crowds. Huge platian fan may also work.

Any disca with hit should be good, but the rares (bravemen, rainbow) will most likely deal more damage. It'd mostly be used for fighting the dragon, the caves boss, and ep 4 boss. Honestly, even without uber sd from pbs, this weapon's hard attack can deal more or equivalent damage to these bosses compared to just nuking (caves boss excepted, but you can regen tp with the double saber as you nuke).

FOnewearls can equip red sabers, but not worth it, imo, unless she has a red or crimson coat. Inferno bazookas would also work, but it takes evp away, so keep that in mind. the angel harp is a nifty weapon, but the special isn't very useful, nor does it hit often in ult, unless the rifle has hit.

In general rule of thumb, don't expect the FOnewearl to deal more than 500 damage in ultimate mode. Average hard attack is about 200-300


btw. tactic to fight ult dorphan: paralyze with holy ray, use c-bringer's demons to take down hp. rinse and repeat until dead.

girt tactic, same, but make sure you have freeze and shock units to make your life easier.

good luck and have fun

Last edited by ユリネ; 12-01-2006 at 11:14 PM.
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  #22  
Old 12-01-2006, 11:29 PM
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I must say I'm impressed, for your first post that was incredibly well worded and executed. Welcome to the forums. If you have any questions, which seeing the wordage and the grammar, you've already read the forum rules. As such, you can PM any of the Staff/Senior members with any additional questions.


Yes, I agree with you that it IS possible. But the question remains: Is it practical, and is it going to be fun? For both questions I say no......You want nothing more out of you FOney than to be a nuker, mine does it quite well, and any well managed party knows to hold 4-5 Trifluids for their FO's (each). For that reason, the second part of the question is, will it be fun....I suppose they could, but why go that route when you could satisfy those needs with a FOmar/l, who melee far better, even if the FOney has higher ATA, specials on FO's mean almost nothing in Ultimate, except on wepons with insanely high hit%. It's like saying is making a nuking HUnewearl either fun or pratical?: No, it's not. You can make her one I'm sure, but you're just messing with the characters true potential, and really just relegating it to a support role.
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  #23  
Old 13-01-2006, 01:00 AM
ユリネ ユリネ is offline
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Thanks for the welcome to the forums.

As for the post, I mainly submitted it as a response to Jarl's initial post as to what weapons could be used for a melee fonewearl. I added the bit on the dex mag since a lot of fonewearls who want to melee always seem to forget or don't know what stats their mag needs. It was also as a response to the guide submission and something of a different to a more in-depth opinion.

As for whether having a melee FOnewearl would be practical and/or fun, the practicality will always be debatable to the team. I don't dispute the support role. FOnewearls should never and can never go up against the chaos bringer solo, and there is damage cancel, but there are other ways of supporting a team rather than just nuking. Some enemies, at least in ep4, cannot be frozen, etc. which would require other methods of immobilization that ra/gibarta can never provide (holy ray paralysis). And, as I said before, a melee FOnewearl can also stay away from p2 longer to PB with the rest of the party, something pure spellcasters in BB have a very, very difficult time doing. And with proper equipment planned out, the FOnewearl can have quite an impact with specials in ult mode.

For the individual melee FOnewearl, I consider the personal practicality to be much better. In any random party, at least on BB, all characters are usually essentially for themselves, and the FOnewearl is usually relegated to be the only support character with few other characters bothering to help the FOnewearl when she's in a tight situation (eg. resta), let alone provide extra fluids. (I won't even bother with what happens when a rare drops.) The amount of TP regen, if the FOnewearl opts to do it, is a massive bonus. While the difference may not seem that significant compared to the FOmar* classes, the difference adds up through a long ultimate desert run. Plus, I consider pure nukage boring after a while.

Which leads into the fun factor. I find the melee FOnewearl to be quite fun, and no one complains about it. I find it as a matter of play style and the uniqueness that, from what I've seen, no one else really does... at least in BB. And not all parties have the mix of RAs, HUs, and androids. Being able to compensate for the lack of these factors in the party is a challenge that I find to be a lot of fun, since the optimal equipment is usually not there there. The "nuking" HUnewearl is sometimes a necessary must and be relagated made to support while meleeing when there is no FO in the party. Others (as I can name a few) can be said to be a FO reincarnate in a HUnewearl body. It's very similar to the meleeing FOnewearl where she can melee while supporting. It's all really a matter of a drastically different playing style for those who really want to bother with it and how far they want to take it. They can still retain the original role of the character, but expand it to do other things that may not be of a norm, and I find the melee FOnewearl pliable to do exactly just that to my tastes and style.

Last edited by ユリネ; 13-01-2006 at 01:28 AM.
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  #24  
Old 13-01-2006, 02:10 AM
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While I don't have BB I will agree that you know you can't fully melee, as a HUne or RAmarl you can't fully nuke. Class specifities are made for a reason. I can surmise that it's not even possible to fully create one for damage/special purposes without the right equipment. For what I've heard, the Viv is an essential wepon if you wish to play as a melee FOney, as I'm reduced to EP 1&2, I'm stuck playing with a Double Saber, not a damage dealing wepon. Nor with a hit%-less one, I'm stuck with sub-par ATA, even on a mag that I would plan on maxing out with. So it goes for stealing the TP or damage. Again, it comes down to necessities, what do you need and what can you get rid of? If you're meleeing as a FOney, you need the ATP and the ATA, this will cut off your TP majorly, especially material usage, because instead of playing 'Today's Rate' for TP Materials, you'll be hunting HP Materials. That will hurt the players usefulness as a FO. I find complete nuking fun, when I control it. I have two melee FO's a melee RA, and a HUne, and I find nuking when I'm playing with my brother who's a HUcast is more satisfying than playing with some of the others. If I'm going to be relegated to a support role, I'd rather be spectacular at it, than mediocre at it. This is why HUmars and RAmars are known as 'n00bmars', they're mediocrity (sp), they're "Jack of all trades, master of none." With PSO, the middle ground never suffices. That's why you'll never see a succesful Tower run with a HUmar. Why use them when a HUne can do what they can tech wise times two? What a HUcast can do in damage times two? What a HUcaseal can do hitting times two? That's the question you need to ask yourself. Do you want to be mediocre at what you like to do, when others do it better, or fantastic at what you were made for and have time better spent in that area. Some would argue that "Well RAmarls were made as RAngers and are good at melee." This is a moot point. You wouldn't see a RAmar purely tech casting. Just like you wouldn't see a FOney strictly meleeing. Therefore your definition of melee is merely a support FOney who can hit with specials. This is nothing new, as FOnewms can even make very decent support characters. And I've actually seen some decent at melee, case in point Rico_Royal. But realize the difference. Support is SUPPORT, which mean they do mostly R/A S/D J/Z and then may hit an enemy or two. That is not melee, there is a difference.

The rare dropping is something you want to clear up before hand, if you call the wepon, and are playing with a team (And especially if they're reliable i.e. members of this forum
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  #25  
Old 13-01-2006, 04:28 AM
ユリネ ユリネ is offline
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Perhaps, then, we didn't see eye-to-eye on the definition of what a melee FOnewearl is. The definition I go by is any type of physical combat (with a fair amount of engagement, not just a hit or two), no matter how little the damage that may go along with any or how much support or nuking that goes with the territory. You seem to go by what the majority of time is spent doing or by how the character is fine tuned to a certain task.

True, the FOnewearl has TP issues when she melees, since she sacrifices mind in place of dex and pow, and she has to continuously move and cast spells. However, (unless your version of PSO has been tweaked for in how specials hit), the double saber is a key component since the 50-hit double saber (at least in BB) can consistently hit episode 1 monsters with n-n-s or n-s-s combos to regenerate the tp back when her base ATA is maxed. There may be objections as to the amount of HP that can be healed with mind sacrificed as well, but I hadn't run into any situations where one resta can't restore HP lost from two or three critical hits, unless it has been in the towers. And, as I have said, coupled with a large TP reserve, it's equivalent to an effectively large, or infinite, TP supply that results in a much less reliance in using fluids and in an effectively constant melee/nuke/support role, with emphasis on the melee but priority on support. I haven't heard of the results of anyone doing this with a FOnewm, but with the FOnewearl, it's a spectacular way of playing without a dull or quiet moment.

As for rares, yes, the called rares usually go to the ones who called them in the first place, but those that aren't are snatched up by those who are closest to the monster who dropped it, usually the meleers. Call may it greed, but I also melee so I can get that much closer to the rares, despite what may occur with sychronization problems with the game.

With the vivienne, yes, it can deal considerably more damage compared to a double saber. If you're attacking one monster, it would be the way to go, if you want to kill it as quickly as possible. Up against a crowd, you'd might as well go with an umbrella or fan. That said, the vivienne is just like a double saber, but just dishes out more damage. Honestly, I've been leveling and fighting with strictly the double saber and have no qualms of not having the vivienne on me, mostly because of all the tp I get back

Last edited by ユリネ; 13-01-2006 at 04:44 AM.
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  #26  
Old 13-01-2006, 12:10 PM
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The best way for a FOnewearl to damage is to use Demon's, since this special is independent from ATP.

What I regret with melee FOs (in general, not FOnewearl) is that they focus on meleeing at the detriment of efficient support, only to deal 20-30% of the Hunters and Rangers' damage.

As long as you support perfectly well, you can melee, but I don't see that happening.
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  #27  
Old 13-01-2006, 06:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kefka
The best way for a FOnewearl to damage is to use Demon's, since this special is independent from ATP.

What I regret with melee FOs (in general, not FOnewearl) is that they focus on meleeing at the detriment of efficient support, only to deal 20-30% of the Hunters and Rangers' damage.

As long as you support perfectly well, you can melee, but I don't see that happening.

agreed, but when im playing online, la de da, ive casted s/d/j/z, and my spells are doing about 150 damage for a quite large tp cost, so if its something pretty puny i normally go up and hit it. ive decided not to do the 2 mag thing, but get myself a decent % summit moon, grind it and after ive s/d/j/z 'ed and am just running round trying not to get hit, i think i may as well do something, so run up to a monster and twat it for about 80 damage... its crap, i know, but its better than nothing and ive s/d/j/z'ed, nuking isnt my thing (not enough dmg), and if im meleeing ill be restaing more which cant be bad?

also, i am on the lookout for demons stuff with hit, prefferably a raygun and if i can hit with it at all well, i may start using it in place of the summit moon (seeing as i rarely cast single spells online) except during bosses. holy ray is another idea, but im not sure how much i want to hunt one with hit my friend has one with hit, but it wont be cheap to trade!
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  #28  
Old 13-01-2006, 07:26 PM
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Indeed, it would be self-defeating NOT to cast S/D/J/Z using ANY melee force. I'm guessing Kefka was referring more to resta/anti... but if you wore a resta merge or carried a Marina's Bag around, you could heal pretty well without going very far.
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  #29  
Old 13-01-2006, 10:33 PM
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i don't really understand melee forces FOmars yes coz they're fast but the others i don't see the point
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  #30  
Old 13-01-2006, 11:05 PM
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They're a laugh, a good challenge. People sometimes respect you for being different, but, if you stop supporting people get mad. And, I would have to admit, pick the class you want to play as. Want to melee? Pick a hunter...

(Having said that I have a melee foney - hypocrit of the year award)
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